Leaders know that change is inevitable but adapting to it is not.  There are specific things that the most effective leaders do that help make them better at adapting.  This is a skill that you too can learn. 

In this episode you’ll learn:

  • The importance of being open to opportunities 
  • Why allowing people to learn from their mistakes is critical to success 
  • The importance of imagination to leadership success 
  • Why listening is so critical to lead effectively 
  • The value of broad-based, life-long learning


 Learn about how to create a culture where management is open to learning.


The Transcript

Brad Wolff 00:19  

Welcome to “It is About You” Today’s guest is Christopher Drew. Christopher is an example of someone who has learned and developed by his wide variety of experiences He has a law degree, three patents and telecommunications, and a strong interest in art. His roles have included Operations Manager, IT project manager Business Analyst, and Financial Executive. He’s worked for both small to mid-sized and extremely large companies.  

In 2012, Christopher left the corporate world and purchased A-R-T & Associatesan Atlanta based creative firm that uses Art Branding Exhibits and Interior Signage to accent renew or transform its client’s office environments into cool and inviting places that people really want to be inThe service, the corporate healthcare and hospitality markets under Christopher’s leadership A-R-T & Associates has grown from 1 million in annual sales and a staff of six to over 4 million in annual sales in a team of 18 that’s in only five or six years.  

They broaden the firm service offerings developed a strong team of creatives and established an excellent reputation with well-known companies in the Atlanta market and across the country.  

So, Christopher welcome to the show.  

Christopher Drew 02:03  

Well, thank you for having me. Brad.  

Brad Wolff 02:05  

Absolutely! So, you’ve had quite a varied experience.  

I wonder if you can just take me through a little bit of your origin story that brought you to the work that you do today? 

Christopher Drew 02:17  

Well, I’m a believer of someone who continually pursues their academic interests. Thus, my undergraduate degree was in economics and then in literature. And then I was interested in in the law field, so I went to law school, not knowing exactly where I wanted to pursue. 

After graduating from law school, working as a working in that field with the Indiana State Attorney General’s office. I determined the law profession was not for me. And had an opportunity to help increase the sales and presence of my wife’s family on printing company. So we moved to Atlanta and we established a graphics department Increase the sales more in tripled the sales of that and unfortunately my father in law passed away, then I had responsibility for running for a couple years, but ultimately wanted to sell that company so that my wife’s parents or my wife’s mother would no longer have to worry about money.  

After that I ended up in some interesting jobs. I had an opportunity to work for genuine parts and that is a is yes, an automobile company a distribution company. But they just did some creative things and I help them automate or more modernize their offering not offerings, but the way they distribute things within their warehouses. So I was responsible for coming up with the procedure manuals, helping the IT folks work through some data problems so that all those screenings and automated the automated conveyor belts work properly and then the warehouse knew what to do, how to do, when to do, when things were coming up through their skin guns, and how to get it on the trucks and out to the stores and other facilities that use Napa auto parts stuff.  

From there, just so happened to live next to someone who at the time work for Bell south and he had gotten promoted into division that he said I need help, and I can’t trust anybody in the organization that is under me to do what needs to be done because it’s always been done in a particular way.  

So I was brought in, that was just a happen stance type of thing that was kind of interesting developed from there and kind of got that going, and because for whatever reason, I understood what was going on, ended up in in finance for that little section of the company that grew into the kind of a division management of all of the finances corporate wise, so capital and expense, which turned out to be an interesting job and I was grateful for the opportunity, but when an opportunity came for me to leave that company leave AT&T that was a good move for us. I had enabled me to stay in Atlanta and do something kind of interesting on my own and that’s how I ended up at ART. 

Brad Wolff 05:38  

So, you essentially bought a small business to run it yourself at that point? 

Christopher Drew 05:43  

I did. And the way I went about it was not looking for a creative or an art-based business I built a filter of what I was looking for and what would benefit from the skills that I had. And it just so happened that we ended up landing in in in the creative field.  

But what was most important was looking for something that was important to me that I could add value in the things that I add could add value for we’re looking forward looking broadly in in bringing some financial structure around being able to do that in a way that would never compromise the success of the company with overloaded debt or creating little hiccups in the way a company that works within the corporate real estate that the construction field operates because projects are long term.  

They are quite large and cash flow is an important thing to keep the business running in between the ups and downs of when things are ordered and when they’re actually paid for.  

Brad Wolff 06:58  

Got it! Now what I noticed from your background is a consistent theme of willingness to change an interest in learning new things that stands out to me. So, how has that impacted your success over the years? 

Christopher Drew 07:08  

I think anyone can be successful. Whether there’s focused on a thing and go after that goal wholeheartedly. But success is also bred by looking for and being open to opportunities that as they arise and using the skills that you have to must make the most of them. 

So, I’m open to the opportunities success comes from because you’re willing to take either a risk, so that’s what an entrepreneurial type opportunity is or you’re so focused on a particular goal that you’re willing to blow through any roadblock and that is a fee that happens a lot in corporate world and I saw that, but I was always more interested in a broad based thing and taking the opportunity.  

So that’s how I ended up from small business, to IT, to Finance, and now to where I am, is just the opportunity presented itself, and I took it.  

Brad Wolff 08:14  

And clearly, you’re very flexible because a lot of people would say that’s not what I do, I’m not going to do that. So, you have chosen to demonstrate flexibility.  

Christopher Drew 08:24  

And I agree with that. I don’t think that we should be tied to what our educational background is I think flexibility is important. So whenever I talk with whether it’s a young people, or make career people or parents of young people, I say, it really does not matter what your educational background is or what you choose to majoring It gives you a framework with which to approach problems. It is ultimately how you deal with those problems, how to use your framework that you know to solve the problems that are presented to you.  

So yes! Art sounds like it’s not an appropriate major for long term success, but it can be. It gives you things graphically, so visually how things appear makes a big difference to you. It means, so you would be able to approach that someone who’s engineering, it’s all about process.  

I get that process is important, but process is just as important in the field of integrative world as it is in say manufacturing and the creative world. Yeah it visually, it looks good, but how in the world. Is it going to be displayed in an office? Say it weighs three or 400 pounds and they want it on the wall. Well, there’s a process of figuring out how to do that.  

So, engineering works in the creative world, Finance works across pretty much all industries.  

It’s not what your academic interest, it’s how you use that framework to solve the problems you’re presented with and whatever you choose to do  

Brad Wolff 10:05  

That makes perfect sense! So, Christopher under your leadership in only six years your company has grown 400%.  

What do you consider to be the most important character traits that have served you well to be able to pull this off as a leader?   

Christopher Drew 10:23  

Well, I learned from two highly successful people, mentors, and friends. Before I started on this journey within ART & Associates was buying good people, give them expectations and allow them to do what they do. So, kind of get out of the way.  

So as far as a successful as us being successful, I think that even me, being successful is identifying people that are way smarter than me in the areas that I don’t have any clue what’s going on, and I’ll just use visual graphics. I don’t really know how to do that, but I found some very good people and I let them do what they do. I give them the tools I give them the support and let them do what they do.  

That’s more important and that’s how I’ve pretty much managed my career, even in the large corporations, I know what I do, but let the people give the people don’t tell them how to do it, give them the goal and say, go figure it out, and if you run into problems. I’ll help you figure out what those solutions are but go figure it out.  

Brad Wolff 11:40  

That’s a great point. So, not micromanaging and interestingly, I have no problem finding a long list of things. I’m not good at, or don’t understand  

Christopher Drew 11:51  

Me too! I don’t understand where to focus at but I’m finding the, the big thing is finding good people and get out of their way. Let them do what they do best.  

Brad Wolff 11:59  

What tips would you give to people who have been conditioned to really make sure that you have to make sure to watch people carefully because if you don’t, if you take your eye off for a moment they’re going to mess up? 

So, what tips do you have for them to help them let go after giving the goal and allow people to figure out how to reach that goal? 

Christopher Drew 12:23  

So, this is something I struggled with and it in eventually came to terms with it is you give them the goal, give them the “let’s call it the fence posts to stay in between to stay on the road.  

Stay on the railroad track, but essentially, it’s their choice of whether they want to do that. It get getting the mentality of I don’t need to watch you and catch you doing something wrong, I’m expecting you to reach whatever our objective is In within the guidelines that we’ve established, but if you don’t do it. If you aren’t reaching the goal, you’ve chosen not to work for us.  

Instead of it’s my responsibility to micromanage and say itself and give them continuous correction.  

Now, let them self-correct if they don’t reach the goal and they’re choosing not to work for us anymore and that it’s a mentality that you must change yourself that’s… 

Brad Wolff 13:22  

Takes a lot of courage! 

Its life balance and do that.  

Christopher Drew 13:27  

It does, but I find people are more engaged with what they’re doing. If they have control over how they do when they do what they do and some influence of whatever the objective is.  

But ultimately the strategic directive is either defined by our client or long term corporate objective is defined by the leadership and that’s me right now in consultation with the team, so I try to engage them with that, but ultimately, I’m the one that’s deciding what direction we’re going  

But once we’ve figured out the direction, they get to do what hell they do they get to do they get the freedom to do what they do best.  

Brad Wolff 14:07  

And I want to just highlight that. As I hear this, I’m hearing a very clear distinction between leadership and management when you when you describe what you just said.  

Christopher Drew 14:19  

Yeah, my job is somewhat management, but really, my job is not to manage them I’m hiring enough people that they know what to do and they self-manage themselves and they work as a team to get what needs to be done for our clients and that is important because ultimately, we are a service oriented business.  

Regardless of what ultimate stuff we produce we’re a service-oriented business and we need to serve the client.  

Brad Wolff 14:52  

So, how can we understand what that what you do in the selection process because not everyone is ready to take on responsibility or ownership?  

I look at the personal development ladder of employees; the lowest level is needed constant direction and supervision, which obviously wouldn’t work with the people you’re hiring.  

The next level is takes responsibility. Okay, this is my job. I’m gonna make sure.  

Brad Wolff 15:50  

So, the Personal Development Ladder of needs constant supervision and direction to take responsibility to take ownership.  

Tell me a little bit about how you’re selecting people so you’re not hiring the people that are at the lower bottom level of the development ladder.  

Christopher Drew 16:27  

So that’s always a tough thing. The benefit I’ve had is people we don’t go out and search for people very often. In fact, I’ve only done it once. And most people approach us, and so we have either worked with them as a company in some other aspect of their careers or someone on my team has personal engagement with them or and so we already know kind of how they work observation. It’s not just a six-week observation.  

This is over several years. The fortunate part of working in a cool industry, we’re doing cool things is, people want to work for companies that are doing it. And that’s may not always be the case, but right now it is so I’ve been able to recruit peoplemainly by having my choice of people who are recruiting me to hire them.  

And that’s, that’s kind of an interesting way to go about it. But so far in the six years that we’ve been doing this, that’s been quite the benefit for us.  

Brad Wolff 17:33  

Now, do you have any chips and you were in the corporate world to for those folks that aren’t in that situation, the volume of people they need to hire and the pool of people there you know that they’re getting don’t afford that they already know a lot about the person? 

Christopher Drew 17:48  

Right! So I have decided that if we don’t know a lot about a person, It’s kind of like if you are going out and interviewing a number of vendors for your company, you’re going to want to trust those vendors to deliver for you so that you’re delivering for your customers.  

That’s essentially what you’re doing. So, you don’t on the If it’s you’re buying a ream of paper. Okay, probably doesn’t matter what vendor. It is ultimately. But if it’s someone that really affects the product or service with what you’re delivering you’re going to spend some time making sure you trust, not just the salesperson, or the technical person, or whoever is does the delivery, but the reputation of that company that you’re using, because ultimately, you’re going to be relying on that company to help you deliver for your customers.  

Well, that’s the process we go through, it’s a little different with individuals because there’s less than you can ask, legally, but that doesn’t mean you can’t do interviews over a period of time, meaning not just one day, one week it would be two or three interviews over probably a month period of time. It’s having them come in and do a sample project.  

Yeah, I compensate them for that, so if I’m having them come in for half a day. I’m going to pay them 50 or a hundred bucks, it’s that way. I’m paying their time, it doesn’t, it’s a little bit different. I don’t have to pay them, but I think it makes for a transaction that feels a little more reasonable to be expected to develop a small graphic design of a wall or something.  

Brad Wolff 19:42  

We’re looking at of you, so you take advantage of some ways to go deeper than just what a person tells you in an interview.  

So, you’re looking under the hood more instead of just looking at the outside and kicking the tires.  

Christopher Drew 19:56  

The tough thing on that is for sales, because that is a tough process to understand if they’re ready to approach the companies that we to which we sell, but there are still ways to do that. And that is, hey, sell me on why I should use the current company, you are with If I like their approach, then that might, it might work. I asked who their current clients are they at the level that I want them to be selling it because we don’t sell to the small medium sized business; we’re selling into facility managers.  

We’re selling to Executives at large corporations, were selling to interior and architectural firm for selling to general contractors, all of which put their reputation their own reputation on the line when they hire us.  

So, it’s important that I’m giving them somebody who they can trust until I must learn how to trust them.  

And I do that by doing mock interviews, what the mock interview is not an interview them specifically for that position, it’s an interview of hey if you’re trying to sell me your service, how would you go about it.  

We just follow through that process.  

Brad Wolff 21:18 

So, what I gather from what you’re saying is you’re also looking heavily at character traits, not just skills.  

So, with that in mind, what do you consider to be the most important character traits that are needed to be a highly effective leader not skills but character traits? 

Christopher Drew 21:38  

So, imagination isIf you can’t imagine the possible, then you’re not going to be an effective leader.  

Too many people in all sorts of work environments See, it hasn’t been done this way or what about this, what about that. But if that’s the future you want, and you can imagine and that’s the future you want you can get there, that it may be a meandering path, but if you don’t have imagination.  

The second is, follow through. So, any idea can be an absolute great idea. But if you don’t start putting the little steps in place, okay, say you want we want to go to the moon. What’s the first thing we need to know how if we can have to get enough thrust? Okay. How do we develop a rocket that has enough thrust? We’re not are you talking about any of the logistics.  

That’s the first step; can we get enough for us to get it across the gravity barrier?  

Yes, it’s been that was solved, but that was probably the first step, they went through, then, do we have the directional systems?  

Okay, well, we don’t have a big enough computer to do that, so we need to develop a computer. So those it’s just one step one small problem at a time, and it doesn’t seem as daunting as the other. So that follow through is equally as important as imagination and in the last, the last thing is… 

You must realize that no matter what job, what company what industry you’re working with people  

So, it is, if to be effective, to be a great leader, you have to trust in the people and learning to trust in those people, to do the great things that they can do is what a leader needs. If you’re having to micromanage if you’re having to come back and self-check That’s not building a brand of trust. It’s not allowing them to expand their horizons expand their capabilities beyond what they thought they could do.  

So, if you’re to be effective, to be a great leader, if you have imagination, if you have followed through, in that trust in your staff to trust in your team.  

Brad Wolff 24:03  

And that trust is what allows them to develop because you’re not putting a hindrance on micromanaging.  

So, these are the characteristics that you see, what do you consider to be the most important skills that leaders need to master to be effective? 

Christopher Drew 24:23  

It’s a little bit of a cliché, not a little bit. It’s a big cliché, but the two ears, one mouth, listen, more than you listen more than you speak, that’s, that’s a big thing.  

So, listening as is a big skill and the other is when you are speaking when you are communicating in a direction out from you to be concise coherent and be very direct.  

So, listening but your communication skill must be good if you sound like you are meandering you aren’t it will sound like you aren’t confident in what direction you want to want somebody to go  

And so, to me, the two biggest skills and they sound that they are very soft skills, it’s listening in effective communication and that’s both verbal and in written  

Brad Wolff 25:24  

Well, isn’t it funny the soft skills are usually the hardest to get good at?  

Christopher Drew 25:28  

They are very hard to get good at. 

Brad Wolff 25:31  

That shouldn’t be called soft skills anymore, given how hard they are. 

Christopher Drew 25:34  

Well, I would agree with that. And that’s and that’s where education is important. Because in today’s world, we have focused a lot on what are you going to do, what degree are you going to get to get you a job?  

Well, essentially a degree gets you your first job, but what makes you effective are some of the things are being broad based to having a broad base of knowledge.  

So, you can develop those soft skills of communication of listening because if you are just so focused on that narrow rail of what you learn, you’re not going to be open to the things that are coming to you.  

Brad Wolff 26:18  

Great point!  

So that brings us kind of natural Segway to what’s your definition Christopher of Personal Development? 

Christopher Drew 26:31  

If you are not engaged in what you’re doing. You’re not developing So, personal development is not any specific goal to me, its personal development is being engaged in what you’re doing and allowing that to open opportunities for you to grow and embrace those opportunities when I started this business. I was not the best at interpersonal communications. It’s not that I wasn’t effective, it’s just I wasn’t the most comfortable doing it because before I came purchase ART and Associates, I worked in a corporate structure that gave you guidelines.  

So, it made it easy, but that doesn’t make it comfortable for me to do it. I just could follow the rules that were given to us to manage lower level employees to effectively communicate upward  

Because those rules of engagement or define either in writing or within the corporate culture that was that was already there.  

So, you can learn how to do that, you didn’t have to be comfortable doing it if you follow the written in unwritten rules. You could be effective.  

In your own company, the leader creates the culture and thus, you must be comfortable with doing setting up that culture of communication and that was a struggle for me in the beginning. 

So, that development that opportunity embracing opportunity, both through personal, personal coaching, but just going to okay I was never a salesperson. I went through a year sales training to be a sales manager, not so that I would be a sales manager. It was so I understood the sales process and what a salesperson would need to do.  

I took classes in graphic design. So, I kind of knew they aren’t. I’m not good at graphic design, but I know the process now on how someone goes about doing it.  

So, it’s embracing those opportunities that are presented, because that those are hurdles that were put in front of me to grow the company in so you to embrace those hurdles and figure out how to go get around them, get over them, knock them over whatever so that you can be successful.  

So embracing those opportunities that that, to me, that’s the Personal Development, If you have different goals, that’s probably of what that is, you’re going to be too focused on approaching those specific goals and be less open to what’s around you that would actually say you need I’ll use the Road Runner, not the Road Runner, the Bugs Bunny. 

The Bugs Bunny a turn left at Albuquerque, you may need to make a left turn at Albuquerque, and you don’t know if you’re to focus on what the goal is.  

Brad Wolff 29:26  

So, what I’m gathering also from this is the theme of willingness to be uncomfortable is… 

Christopher Drew 29:31  


Brad Wolff 29:32  

Is so key and what you’re talking about.  

Christopher Drew 29:36  

You need to be open to being uncomfortable and uncomfortable for days, not just ours but days, maybe even a couple of months until you figure out… 

Brad Wolff 29:46  

Maybe even years in some cases and in fact is just being comfortable, a good thing if you want to grow.  

Christopher Drew 29:53  

It’s not a fun thing to be going through, but if you have a support structure around you that are outside of your business outside of your Industry, whether that’s friends, that’s family. It’s church some other support structure that you can vent a little bit.  

And there’s no judgment coming back, though they may or may not give you good ideas but at least it’s it allows you to let off steam and then come back refreshed to be uncomfortable, but if you don’t have that that vent or support structure it, it could be very, very uncomfortable, but being uncomfortable, that uncertainty is where the opportunities are. 

Brad Wolff 30:40  


So, Chris, what regular practices, do you have that you feel help your effectiveness the most as a leader? 

Christopher Drew 30:49  

So, there are a couple things. I’m on during the week in two to three mornings a week it’s somewhere between 40 minutes in an hour that I don’t take a phone. I don’t they don’t really talk to me. I go running so you, it could be some days. It could be as simple as just focus. Okay, how many steps are you taking? You’re thinking about something completely off the wall, it could be hey, I this I’m playing around with this idea. I don’t know how to do it. Let’s look at the trees and then you halfway through the run it comes back to you. Well, what about this over, over time, that, that helps.  

The other thing is finding your relaxation space and that could be a walk in the woods. It could be sitting on your patio with a beer. It could be your morning coffee, just some way to unwind and I guess.  

The third thing is I read a lot and read varied because ideas can come from anywhere. It could be coming from, you know, the, the beach novel.  

You know, there could be a good idea, in that it could come from reading some business book. Yeah, those are good, but sometimes those are just on reading them because I must. It could be reading about a biography about Albert Einstein or Thomas Edison or an author like Alec Baldwin or something.  

Brad Wolff 32:25  

So, the varied reading? What I’m I’m hearing is a them of education being varied as opposed to laser focused on that come up with you and that’s been a big help in your development and effectiveness?  

So, what’s the biggest setback or obstacle that you’ve overcome that you feel has been key to your success?  

Christopher Drew 32:54  

Biggest obstacle…. Obstacles seem big when you’re approaching them, but the obstacle the really the obstacle that’s the biggest is yourself in your own uncertainty is at least within the process of becoming an entrepreneur., that’s probably the uncertainty of am I good enough? Do I have the answers? Do I even need the answers? Is this the right decision?  

Because you’re taking a leap that coming from taking a salary where whatever your salary is if you’re making $20,000 a year $100,000 a year you knew that was coming, and I’m doing a good job. You have the reviews to that uncertainty of, I don’t know where, if we’re going to even be able to sell whatever we’re trying to do.  

And that to me is overcoming that mental roadblock is the most freeing thing, so the, I think the biggest hurdle is being able to embrace uncertainty and risk.  

Brad Wolff 34:10  

Right! Because you at the end of the day, you know that you’re just doing a daily experiment.  

And you must be okay with the fact that you do not know what the outcomes are going to happen. 

Christopher Drew 34:23  

Yes! If you have a job, there’s uncertainty am I going to have a job tomorrow, but generally your capitals, not at risk if you lose that job. It’s In an entrepreneurial world you’ve invested your, your money and it’s your income.  

So, it’s a double-edged sword if things don’t work out and so, embracing risk in uncertainty is a big thing. But once you’re able to do that, it is a bit free because then you don’t really have a job, you have  

Kind of a life in a way that is intertwined with all the other things you do, because that risk means, you know, to I am the boss. and yeah, I need to do these things, but it’s important for me to be effective for my team to also go see my, my kid run cross country or to, you know, today I just do not feel the energy to do it, so the best thing for the business is for me to stay home and watch a movie.  

Well that’s risky because you’re no not in the office, seeing what people are doing. But that’s the best thing for the business is to be away from the business for that day because you need to rejuvenate yourself.  

Brad Wolff 35:42  

So, you’re always asking the question of what the best thing is and not just getting stuck in routine. Just because you’re going to, you said you’re going to do it. 

Christopher Drew 35:52  

Yes, ultimately, what’s best for the business will be what’s best for you personally because the two things are tied together as an entrepreneur! 

Brad Wolff 36:04  

ChristopherWhat’s the funniest or craziest experience that you’ve ever had, as a leader? 

Christopher Drew 36:14  

Well, the funniest when we had a company, one of our clients come and asks, can you put a car on the wall. Your reaction was the same as ours, what do you mean put a car on the wall? They said, yeah, display when we want a car hanging from the wall. Okay, we need to think about that for a minute.  

So, it turned out we came up with a way to do it, and it turned out to be a very good thing.  

But to me that those types of things are funny because we don’t know what our customers are gonna ask that because the same customer then came back and said okay, we want an SUV on the 20 the 22nd floor of the word corporate offices. How do you get a car 27 floors up, it doesn’t fit in an elevator? 

Brad Wolff 37:19  

It sounds almost it’s like someone, it sounds like a prank when you first get that? 

Christopher Drew 37:26  

And they really wanted to do it. We ultimately talk them out of it because the logistics was not, but those are funny to me because we get asked to do very weird things and those puzzles aren’t necessarily creative puzzles their engineering or logistics puzzles and that’s not what we are.  

But it’s all part of the display, so those things are funny to me.  

And I think that we funny to your listeners as well because whoever heard of putting a car on the 22nd floor, just to be in this in their lobby display? 

Brad Wolff 38:01  

That’s a little eccentric! And you know what, like you said, leaders need a great imagination.  

There was a leader that had one heck of an imagination to come up with that one.  

You gotta admit, that’s a great Leader  

Christopher Drew 38:15  

Is a great leader, ultimately, we came up with a different solution that works for them to get the same effect but putting oh yeah, an entire car engine everything in them all good.  

Just logistically wasn’t going to work.  

Brad Wolff 38:29  

Yeah, I’m glad you didn’t do that. So, what are one or two things that people really wouldn’t learn about you from a Google search that that would be particularly interesting or unique about you? 

Christopher Drew 38:47  

You know, I try not to Google search. So, I don’t know, it what is out there on me.  

Couple of things that are the interesting that I have a law degree is kind of interesting in a creative field that’s,  yeah, you probably could find it as a Google search, but that’s trying to tie that to me now probably 30 years hence is probably a tough thing. 

I guess, not secretly but a love of theater. I like live theater; I would prefer to go to live theater friends with people out in Lawrenceville Anthony Rodriguez and income Carol Pence at the Aurora theater and friends with the creative director here in Dunwoody Robert Egizio. 

Just developing those friendships in in a space that I don’t really know anything about but love to go watch people perform and I’ve really enjoyed knowing creative people in that live performance arena.  

Brad Wolff 39:57  

I’m going to Google search when we’re done here to see if I can find that, but I have a guest that might not come up.  

And what URLs would you like to promote for the listeners to be aware of? 

Christopher Drew 40:11  

So, we do we kind of publish our projects both on our website, which is it ARTandASSOCIATES.com 

So, ART and Associates dot com  

Or on our Instagram, Instagram page which is @ArtAssoc 

Brad Wolff 40:39  

And what are one or two top reasons that listeners should visit your website, Christopher? 

Christopher Drew 40:45  

If you’re looking to change your space look for creative things, it’s whether we do it or not, it’s going to give you some inspirational ideas of what’s possible to put it into an interior office space or It could be your conference room, It could be your opening atrium just what’s possible.  

What, what can make things inviting so that people, whether it’s your employees, your vendors or your customers coming into your office, make it feel like hey, I want to be here and I understand what you guys do, just by walking in your office. 

Brad Wolff 41:23  

Got it! And that has some real value. 

And if you’ve got a large SUV to bring up a lot of high level you probably don’t need to call him, you can call when someone else for that. 

Brad Wolff 41:37  

One last thing any premiums to premiums that you’re offering listeners and anything, anything that would  

Stand out and it does? 

Christopher Drew 41:51  

So, generally what we always will engage with people on the front end to see what’s possible. We don’t do a real design, but we can do we always are open on the front end to do what ifs. Hey, what would you like to see done and we’ll spend an hour or two talking about what if for your office? It’s not an official graphic design, but it’s some precedent imagery. It’s some wish list types of types of things and it will get your Ideas flowing of what you might want for your office and we do that with many, many customers and clients before they pay us a dime.  

I’m a believer and giving away Information giving away some ideas on the front end to help you get where you want to be where you need to be without charging you for it because ultimately  

It gets both of us to where we need to be it one you learn if we’re the right company to help serve you, but to you learn what’s possible to put in your office and both of those are valuable. 

Brad Wolff 43:03  

And that’s a great point because that could be what’s holding the person back there just thinking now, you can do that, not realizing that, you sure can.  

You might be able to do even more than you originally thought in better. 

Christopher Drew 43:12  


Brad Wolff 43:12  

So, that’s a great opportunity! 

Christopher, I want to really thank you for taking time out of your busy day to share things that have been very helpful for you that can be applied by listeners in apply to many ways 

Christopher Drew 43:28  

Well, I appreciate you having me on Brad, it was an enjoyable experience.  

Brad Wolff 43:33  

Thank you, Christopher!